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English native-level required ?

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Tanuki
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MessagePosté le: 08 Mai 2006 14:13    Sujet du message: English native-level required ?

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Hello !

I post this topic because I recently visited the siteweb named Gaijinpot. I'm a French student and I want to study Japanese after my baccalauréat, but I don't know exactly what I'm going to do after. Working in Japan ? Starting from this point of view, I visited some website in order to have an idea of what is proposed... and I realized that the majority of the job offers were reserved for people with a native-level English.
My question is : what a native-level exactly means ? Do you have to be born in a country where English is the current language ? Or is it sufficient to have a very good English level, oral as well as written, even if your country of origin is not an anglphone one ?

I look forward to reading your answers !

T.
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Kurisumasukukkii
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MessagePosté le: 08 Mai 2006 14:22    Sujet du message:

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Native-level means that you are more than fluent on the language, spoken as well as writen. This is mostly assumed when you are from a country where english is the main language.
Well, in fact, this doesn't mean that non-native speaker are worse than native speaker...

We did have a discussion about what "fluent", "native", etc, means in one of the french sections of this forum.
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Tanuki
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MessagePosté le: 08 Mai 2006 14:41    Sujet du message:

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Thanks a lot Kurisumasukukkii for your fast answer !
I'll take a look in the topic you advised me !

PS : Sorry for my bad English (oral/spoken Arrow Embarassed )
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eve
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MessagePosté le: 08 Mai 2006 15:48    Sujet du message:

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Native level implies your English is so good that people from an English-speaking country would not notice that you are actually not from an English-speaking country.

Ideally, this would be a language you learned from your family or in school when you were young (Japanese who have lives for several years in English-speaking countries, "kikoku shijo", usually qualify). If you've grown in France and didn't have a parent or close relative from whom you learned English at a young age, it would suppose that you'd have received English-language education in your country (eg in international/American schools etc) or had a particularly intensive English language education.

Most schools asking for Native level are really asking for that. It wouldn't hurt to try and apply anyway, but from my experience most of the ads at Gaijinpot are like that. If you really want to teach English rather than French, you should aime for the smaller, backwater schools in the countryside etc - and these usually don't advertise on sites like Gaijinpot - and try to have an English teaching (ESL) degree. This is no longer the 80s where about any white foreigner could be an English teacher regardless of their ability.
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perrot
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MessagePosté le: 03 Nov 2007 18:37    Sujet du message:

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Just to say one thing... if you're really good at English and you used to study or live abroad, you may have a better level in academic English than some native speakers can have... indeed, if I focus on written language: it is not easy for everybody to write (a letter, a document or a report) and lots of native speakers may not be as good as you can be because you learned and practiced written and academic English (for exemple). I'm telling that because even in French you can notice that not everybody can write properly and sometimes you can be really surprised by documents made by foreigners. Same thing with spoken language: I've always been amazed by an old English teacher I had at university. Her French level was so good that she was able to correct our French mistakes though we didn't even know we were saying something wrong (because she studied grammar though we assume we know it because we're French)!! Still, it's difficult not to make any mistakes especially when you speak but I think that depending on the type of job, a foreigner with an excellent English level can perfectly fit the job...
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Shad
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MessagePosté le: 28 Oct 2008 08:33    Sujet du message:

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To be a little more practical, for nearly all the english-teacher positions, it is said English native-level required but actually they are really looking for native-speakers. They don't really mind about how good you are, if you are not a real native you won't have a chance, I know that by experience.

On the other hand, for jobs in English pubs or so, even if it is written "English native-level required" I don't think there should be any problem.
But of course, even if you can speak English fluently, it will be much easier for you to find a job in Japan if you already can speak more or less japanese.
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Oppappi
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MessagePosté le: 05 Déc 2008 06:59    Sujet du message:

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Hello there,

I would like to reply on the question of ''what a native-english level exactly means'' ?

Well first of all don't panic and start thinking that you can't have a job because you don't come from a country which isn't a native-english speaking country.
It just means (like mentionned on the previous post's above) that your english needs to be on the same level as somebody who was born and raised in english ( being born in an english speaking country doesn't mean you actually speak correct english Rolling Eyes )
But how can you proove that on your Curriculum Vitae if you come from a non-english speaking country?
Well you have different options:

- Or you already have the proove on your diplomas that you have native-english speaking skills or that you are perfectly bilingual (if not more)

- Or you have to pass an international english evaluation test like :
--TOEFL
--ESL
--EFL
--TOEIC
--SAT
--GRE
--GMAT

Depending on your study's, which will (if you pass of course) proove that you have a native-speaking level of the english language.

But now what is the difference between all those tests?
Well each test is based on what you, or better said which level of english you want to obtain.

Here is a list of the explanation of the most famous and required tests in the world:

TOEIC:
TOEIC is an acronym that stands for Test Of English for International Communication. It is the most widely used English language exam taken by more than 4 million business professionals worldwide. The TOEIC test measures your ability to use English in daily business situations covering such topics as corporate development, finance and budgeting, corporate property, IT, manufacturing, purchasing, offices, personnel, technical matters, health and business travel. A growing number of international companies recognize the TOEIC as an objective indicator of a person's proficiency in business English.

TOEFL:
TOEFL is an acronym that stands for Test of English as a Foreign Language. It measures your proficiency in the English language in an academic context. Most universities and colleges in the US and Canada require you to take the TOEFL test if you want to apply for a place to study there. In most countries the TOEFL is a computer-based test (CBT), this means you have to follow instructions on a screen and answer questions interactively. The TOEFL test consists of the following disciplines: reading, listening and writing.

GMAT:
GMAT is an acronym that stands for Graduate Management Admission Test. This examination is used by graduate business colleges and business schools to assess their candidates. If you want to apply for a graduate business management program you have to take the GMAT because admissions officers rely on your GMAT score as a predictor for your first year performance.

IELTS:
The International English Language Testing System (IELTS) is a test for students who need to demonstrate English language proficiency for study or work in English-speaking countries.

The IELTS test is recognised in many countries. It is used as a measure of English language proficiency by educational institutions, employers, professional organisations, such as the Australian Medical Council, and by government agencies.


I reccomend you to take or the IELTS or the TOEFL, those are the most popular and asked tests in the world and will make a part of your life easier to find a job Wink
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